Posts by Shining One

17

An Unbeliever's Guide to Believing the Bible

by thinker in

jws believe the bible is god's word and that every word in it comes from god.

it's a waste of time to try to disprove the bible based on science or any source outside the bible, because they just don't stand up to something someone believes came from god himself.

so i've decided to use all that i've learned from jws about the bible to show them that they can't trust everything in the bible.

Shining One

>>JWs believe the bible is God's word and that every word in it comes from God. It's a waste of time to try to disprove the bible based on science or any source outside the bible, because they just don't stand up to something someone believes came from God Himself. So I've decided to use all that I've learned from JWs about the bible to show them that they can't trust everything in the bible.

And the very same point applies to the naturalists doctrines: evolution, accidentalism and atheism. BTW, I hate to tell you this but you’ve been taught by blind guides, so watch out for the next pit.

>>There's an old saying that says, "Seeing is believing." Has anyone actually seen God? Some parts of the bible say that some men have spoken to God "face to face" and elsewhere it says that no man may see God and live (Ex33:20).

Have you ever heard of the theological term, ‘figurative language‘? Obviously not, or you would not post such a ridiculous ‘case in point’. This is a ‘figure of speech’. This is figurative language and there is a discipline of scriptural interpretation devoted to this. “If a passage of scripture appears to contradict a clearer passage then you must ask if the passage is to be taken as literal.”

>>Ask any JW about this and they'll tell you that no one can see God and live, and that all those prophets who are said to have talked to God or seen God, actually saw one of God's angels.

That statement stands true and it is a reference to God in His full glory. God sets the rules: he has the divine providence to enable a spiritual being to materialize but said being cannot do so without God’s specific approval. The most powerful evil spirit, the ‘Bright Morning Star’, Lucifer himself cannot do so. , without God’s permission.

>>"Wait just a minute", you say, " I know a little bit about the bible and Paul said that Satan can transform himself into an angel of light" (2Cor11:14). How do we know those prophets of old weren't being deceived by Satan in the form of one of God's angels? Didn't John say that Satan has deceived the whole world? Doesn't Matt 24:24 say that even the "chosen ones" can be misled? Surely we need to study this carefully to determine the truth. Isn't that what John said to do (John4:1)?

‘Transforming himself into an ‘angel of light’ is a metaphor for Satan mimicking God by producing good works in cults meant to deceive human beings.

>>Let's take a look at Satan in the bible. He's found from first book to the last book of the bible. In both the first and the last he takes the appearance of a serpent (Gen 3, Rev 12). In Genesis, Satan (as the serpent) causes the fall of man and God says to the serpent, "you are the cursed one out of all the domestic animals and out of all the wild beasts of the field" (Gen 3:14). This was the only animal ever cursed by God.

Prophetic language, see the above reference. I bet you were tempted to point out ‘God walking in the garden in the cool of the evening’?

>>Isn't it strange then that Moses performed magic in Egypt with the only animal God ever cursed, a serpent? (Ex 4:2-4). In fact, Moses seems to have had a real love for serpents. He even had his priests make a bronze serpent idol and placed it on a staff. According to your Insight Book the Israelites fell into false and pagan worship of that serpent idol for over 300 years! Do you really think someone like that was talking to and seeing one of God's angels?

And just as the people were bitten by snakes, they looked to the image ‘lifted up’ (under God’s direction) to be saved, just like Jesus was lifted up to ‘bring all men to Him’! This where you can see a typology of Christ before His incarnation. You guys keep missing the point behind the passage and in your rush to ridicule you make all kinds of interpretive errors. I myself love the irony in this set of passages!

>>Could Satan really have fooled Moses? Well, Moses was just an imperfect man so it's certainly possible. And just because a few 'miracles' occurred doesn't really prove it wasn't Satan. In 2Thes2:9 it says Satan uses deception and has the ability to perform "powerful works, lying signs, and portents". Portents are signs of something about to happen; similar to a prophesy.

Again, you are ignoring the providence of God. Satan has no power except that which God grants him. That point is made crystal clear in the book of Job. Lucifer could not ‘touch’ Job without God’s permission!

>>So far this is just circumstantial evidence. Let's see if we can find something more definite in the bible. Look at 2Peter 2:2 "However, there also came to be false prophets among the people..." This clearly says that the people (Israelites) had false prophets among them. But wouldn't the Jews have rejected the false prophets and not included them in the bible? Jesus's own words provide us with the answer: ""Woe, whenever all men speak well of YOU , for things like these are what their forefathers did to the false prophets."(Luke 6:26). The false prophets weren't rejected; they were highly regarded!

Yes and what people kept getting judgment heaped upon them due to their own inequities? They were warned from the beginning of their wanderings and kept it up so well that they crucified the chosen one of God!

>>Read Genesis 15:8-17 concerning Abraham's covenant with his 'god' and tell me if it sounds like a Satanic ritual: cut up the dead animals, separate the halves and have your 'god' walk between the bloody pieces in the form of a dark, smoky cloud with a burning ember at it's center. Doesn't that sound like something Satan would enjoy?

Oh my gosh!!!! You need some education. Go to the library and check out Henry Virkler’s “Hermeneutics, Principals and Processes of Biblical Interpretation’ It is a basic seminary level book that you need to read before you attempt to discredit something you have no understanding of to begin with.

>>You may still find it hard to believe that Satan fooled some of the people in the bible, but there is a clear statement from Jesus that tells us it's true. One day a number of pious Jews came to the Temple to talk with Jesus. These people had followed their religion to the best of their ability as their prophets and priests had instructed them. They said to Jesus, "We were not born from fornication; we have one Father, God". And Jesus replied to them, "YOU are from YOUR father the Devil..." (John 8:31-44).

The Jews ascribed erroneous laws and superstition into their various factions’ teachings! Yes a good analogy for the Watchtower Society but next you go off the ‘deep end’ (see metaphor; don’t take ‘deep end’ as falling in a swimming pool!

>>These people clearly thought they were following God, but Jesus said they'd been deceived by Satan. How much more proof do you need that Satan has put his own lies right inside the bible in order to trick the whole world into worshipping him rather than God?

Ohhhh mannnn, come on now. What can you be THINKING of THINKER, LOL.

>>I suggest you follow John's advice and "do not believe every inspired expression" (even if you find it in the bible), "but test the inspired expressions to see whether they originate with God" (that is, test it against your own conscience), "because many false prophets have gone forth into the world." And some of them made it into the bible, a book compiled by imperfect men.

A book inspired of God, using the imperfect human beings to write infallible scripture!

>>thinker

Thinker? Only on the surface….

Rex

18

THE TEN COMMANDMENTS (there are THREE versions!)

by Terry in

1. thou shalt have no other gods before me.. .

2. thou shalt have no other gods before me.

6. thou shalt not commit adultery.. .

Shining One

Terry,
Are you so interested in smearing scripture (getting 'back' at God) that you let your bitterness color your commentary?
Rex

by Shining One in

are you tired of the arrogant assertions of the elite ex-jw clique here?

here is some powerful ammunition to "demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of god"!

http://www.carm.org/evidence.htm .

Shining One

Cog,
Please do excuse my typo as I also excuse your lightly veiled insult. OHHHH, did I spell every word correctly? If not, please forgive me.
Rex